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Old 07-24-2017, 08:11 PM   #41
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

No scoring on aluminum, so all well there.

The new part is a gm part, not aftermarket, I will need to make sure no debris left in the hole and double check clearances. From old to new. Also the old one did have some sort of garbage (rtv perhaps) in it.

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Old 07-24-2017, 08:36 PM   #42
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

That kind of garbage gets cleaned out when you boil out these parts. There is a much higher risk of rapid engine failure from improperly cleaned and prepped parts than ther is from the spring loaded bypass valve.

Any supposed mandate to replace is based on ancient history with valves of an entirely different design and location in the system. I know it is in the FSM but there is no basis for doing it.

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Old 07-25-2017, 02:03 PM   #43
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Ok. So what do you want me to do?

Nothing yet has provided a clear resolution, to either situations.

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Old 07-25-2017, 03:06 PM   #44
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

You have a new one on the way, the oil one is out now so install the new one that you ordered.

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Old 07-25-2017, 03:33 PM   #45
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

"Nothing yet has provided a clear resolution, to either situations."


Either situation? Are you still concerned about that top screw in the chain guide? It's fine, ignore it. (And, agreed, put in the new relief valve that fits; what's to wonder about?)

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Old 07-25-2017, 04:47 PM   #46
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Issues resolved for now. Thanks guys.

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Old 10-04-2017, 10:19 PM   #47
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Just to update. It's been a good long while.

Got this engine rebuilt. Stage one head port, with intake cam mod. Nothing really serious going on.

In process of getting it installed in the car for the second time....

First time, lost oil pressure after a serious "beating" due to machine shop heating up the oil relief valve in tc. Thinking the valve opened, and then couldn't seal correctly afterwards when it idled. Got that fixed, and checked bearings/oil pump since I was there. All is well... As far as I can tell with an oil pressure gauge and cranking engine with starter. Got more pressure than before. Now that I'm hopefully past that....

Now when the engine was in the car, running..... Fuel trims showed it running lean. No codes btw. When I removed the spark plugs, 1&2 looked like they been running rich.....3&4 still looked new, with exception of fire/spark marks on electrode, if that makes sense.

All injectors are new. Ohmed out (cold) 12.5 across all four.

This engine has above service limit compression, and spark.

My questions are

1. Can the cam mod cause this?

2. Is there a way to see injector pulse without a special tool?

3. Maybe something I'm missing altogether here?

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Old 10-05-2017, 08:02 AM   #48
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

FYI: Plugs 1 and 4 are in series and both fire at the same time, this is also true for plugs 2 and 3. The difference between plug 1 and 4 is the direction of current flow through the plug. What you are describing is a spark plug or wire issue. The 2nd possibility is an ICM issue but the ICM is very remote.

The questions are:
--Exactly what brand of plugs and what exact plug number are you using?

--What brand of plug wires are you using?

--Are you using OEM coils or some aftermarket coil?

Further the coil secondary is NOT grounded to anything. The secondary loop is connected to the block for RFI/EMI shielding through ther plug shell only, this is not a ground path for the firing current.

Do not run with this engine running lean like this at any sustained high RPM, valves will be fried.

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Old 10-05-2017, 09:12 AM   #49
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

I honestly don't recall which plug I'm running exactly. If it helps...ngk 6954 from ra that's on sale.

The plug wires are ac Delco 744QQ.

I am using the coils and icm that came with the car. History unknown.

To add there are no service codes (with exception for auto trans that's not there anymore)

From the info I'm gathering.... From my observations, 3&4 are the problems. Are we on the same page?

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Old 10-05-2017, 01:40 PM   #50
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Quote:
Originally Posted by spacetrace33 View Post
I honestly don't recall which plug I'm running exactly. If it helps...ngk 6954 from ra that's on sale.

The plug wires are ac Delco 744QQ.

I am using the coils and icm that came with the car. History unknown.

To add there are no service codes (with exception for auto trans that's not there anymore)

From the info I'm gathering.... From my observations, 3&4 are the problems. Are we on the same page?

That is your problem as to plug condition and possibly lean condition. You can freely use any NGK BKR* plug as long as it is not also a platinum plug.

The OEM is a BKR5ESA-11 plug and the next colder plug is a NGK 5553 {#BKR6E, BKR6ES11} at 1.42 ea from RA. You may find a colder plug will run better in that engine. Do not attempt to regap the plugs, they are set correctly by OEM. Just inspect for obvious damage.

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Old 10-05-2017, 04:06 PM   #51
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Thought they looked too shiney. Dang. Alright. So here's my plan of attack.

Get new plugs. Listen to injector pulse with long screwdriver. After warm up, take ohm readings again, and check for intake leak by three and four.

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Old 10-05-2017, 04:24 PM   #52
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Nothing else wrong so just change plugs and run gently for a week then check plugs. Do not be exceeding 3000 RPM until you get this solved. Could be lots of things but not injectors, they are actually monitored. I would be looking at fuel pressure with engine running. Those non firing plugs will severely screw up the mixture.

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Old 10-05-2017, 06:07 PM   #53
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Great advice. Thanks.

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Old 10-05-2017, 09:25 PM   #54
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Poor firing plug pair pumps excess O2 into the exhaust convincing the O2 sensor that the system is lean. Good plugs should straighten this out in about 3 minutes of running at idle once the engine is warmed up. The rest of it takes a bit longer to relearn.

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Old 10-08-2017, 06:56 PM   #55
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

It may be time to take 100 steps back.

Primed her up today, with appx 10 psi on oil gauge. Started up fine, changed plugs btw, no codes.

Oil pressure at idle was around 30, maybe a hair higher.

As she started to warm up, the pressure began to drop. It finally dropped to appx 8 and I had to turn it off.

Removed my gauge, bench tested it. It is found to be trustworthy.

Installed factory dummy switch. Decided to do another prime to see if oil light would go out, and it didn't.

Yes. 100 steps back. What to do? Light it on fire?

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Old 10-08-2017, 09:13 PM   #56
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Maybe not 100 steps back, but let's at least talk about reply #37 where there was some confusion about the relief valve, and reply #47 where you commented that something "took a beating" when the shop tried to change that valve. I also noticed a comment about that valve being pressed-in and you may get some leakage if the R & R of it isn't done properly. So, is there any further detail you can give about that "beating"?

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Old 10-08-2017, 09:49 PM   #57
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

The beating referred to engine rpm. I

The first r&r was done with heat by m s.

The second r&r was done by me with a screw driver and 13mm socket.

What did I mess up now

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Old 10-08-2017, 09:59 PM   #58
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

Thought I should add that engine sounded like it was firing better with spark plugs changed.... Haven't removed yet to verify anything.

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Old 10-08-2017, 10:14 PM   #59
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

So... it lost oil pressure while at high rpm? Did you check every bearing, and how? Plasti-gauge may not be accurate enough. What oil viscosity are you using?

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Old 10-08-2017, 10:32 PM   #60
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Default Re: Starting to get into all the small details

I have never seen what is inside the oil pan on this type engine, not even a good picture/diagram. Is there a chance the oil pick-up tube isn't sealed tight? With this pump being not down in the oil and "flooded", I expect any leakage on the suction side could be a problem.

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